MRAs don't care about men.

The following is cross-posted from the Damsel in de Tech blog. Click here to see the original.

I was going to just press "Publish" and let that title stand alone. After all, there's really not much else to be said about it. If the Men's Rights Activists were really, sincerely invested in caring for men and improving their lives, they would do something proactive like, say, holding fundraising drives to establish intimate partner violence shelters for men, and/or promoting and advocating expansion of services for male survivors of sexual violence, and/or working with organizations like OCAP to address male homelessness.

You don't have to operate under a feminist banner to effect positive change in your community and to make things happen. But, golly, you do have to actually put in a lot of hours, and your own blood, sweat, tears, and money to really move mountains.

Arguing on the internet can be productive and useful, considering that you are most likely interacting with other humans on the other end, but that's not the end of it. Not by a long shot.

You want people to take you seriously, MRAs? How about you show us that you actually give a crap about helping your fellow dudes by actually doing something to help them.

Are there any MRA campaigns you're aware of that are doing tangible, productive things for your community? Please let me know so I can put my support behind them.

(Spoiler alert: if your evidence of their activity is one of their poster campaigns, I will laugh you off of the internet. Trolling IRL is not activism)

Resource in dismantling the claims and "proof" of MRAs/"Humanists"

By: Liberate Zealot

One thing trolls/MRAs/"humanists" love doing when they come into feminist spaces is share videos from girlwriteswhat and all her awesome proof that its much harder being a man, patriarchy doesn't exist, and feminists are stupid and man haters.  I'm guessing their propensity to share her videos verses other attempts to discredit feminism is partially because she's a woman and partially because if you're not educated on the topics she discusses then her points can seem persuasive.

Now I'm going to respond to some of her claims, but the focus is responding to people who use girlwriteswhat as proof that feminism is unnecessary.  This post is not directed at girlwriteswhat herself.

General response when people post her videos:
The points made by girlwriteswhat can seem persuasive, however a majority of them are based on inaccurate or misrepresented history/law/practice/science.  A lot of them rely on popular tropes that upon further investigation from reliable/academic sources proves untrue.  In the rare cases what all of girlwriteswhat information is correct she's still faulty in her focus on feminism.  The causes of the issues she correctly names is the Patriarchy/Kyriarchy, which feminism fights against.

The two most popular videos that people share (in my experience) are the ones on "Feminism and the Disposable Male"and the almost two parter about rights of the child, paternal rights, men's responsibility in preventing pregnancy and financial abortions.

The myths within the "Disposable Male"
"Women and Children First" as a successful policy of life saving pretty much began and ended with the Titanic.   Other British ships did claim this policy, but when it came to maritime disasters it was almost never followed. Generally men are much more likely to survive a disaster, this is even more true for the captain and crew ("going down with the ship" was basically another Titanic exception).

Also unlike her claims, current standards of saving people on ships/from fires makes no distinction between men and women. People might need and receive special assistance because they're children/have disabilities/carrying multiple children. Basically you take care of people who need the most care/assistance first which is generally not an able bodied adult of either gender. 

Almost no society in history or our modern era provides resources or care for men last. Now the resources and care people get are very class dependent, but if families/communities don't have enough wealth to care for all their children male children receive the food/healthcare/education first (infanticide and sex based abortions really don't happen to boys). The primary exception to this is when the woman is pregnant/breast feeding (a son). And that's because so many women had miscarriages (1 in 3 or 4) or died in child birth (1 in 3 again) that the extra resources were necessary for them to have a chance of a healthy pregnancy/delivery. 

As for the continuing of the species, child creation is easier for a man.  Men *can* father children on a variety of women.  The costs of pregnancy (time and the 1 in 3 death rates) are much harsher on women.  But when it comes down to it genetic distribution necessitates almost as many reproductively viable men as women.  

Inaccurate representation of causes

Work place death - Men are more likely to die at work, because they're more likely to take dangerous jobs like mining/oil rigging. The reason is women are still often excluded from these jobs. When it comes to dangerous factory jobs and the fire in them women are as likely, if not more likely to die (because they've been locked into the factories). Work place safety is a definite issue, but it's caused by classism/Patriarchy/Kyriarchy, not feminism. And plenty of feminists do work to fight classism and engage in labor movements. 

As for war, women have been soldiers (at lesser numbers then men) for millennia. Also the main attitude of women at battlefields was not about them being locked up and protected, but rather tortured/murdered/raped. Many feminists fight to gain women more fair access as soldiers. Many feminists are also anti-war activists. Some of us even do both. 

Paternal, Maternal and Child's Rights

Preventing pregnancy - Everyone engaging in sex is equally responsible for preventing pregnancies.  Now there isn't a male pill, thought it is scientifically difficult yet possible, but there are two good ways for men to prevent pregnancy. Condoms, which have the extra bonus of protecting from STIs and STDs, and vasectomies which are relatively simple and safe (especially compared to tubal ligation).  If you happen to be in India there's also an even better way for men to control their own birth control.  In India there is a gel injection which can block semen.  It's cheap, lasts for 10 or so years, is easily reversible, and has very few documented side effects compared to hormonal birth control. MRAs also seem to have a great fear of reproductive coercion where women sneakily get pregnant (through the sabotage of birth control) against the wishes of her male partner. And this can and occasionally does happen, but birth control sabotage most commonly is done by men as a form of domestic abuse.   

Abortion is not just an answer to not wanting to be a parent, but is also about body autonomy and not wanting to be pregnant.  Which is why the idea of "fiscal abortion" is rather offensive.  Sure, you don't want to have the legal and financial responsibility of being a parent, but that's what adoption is about.  

Adoption and parental rights also comes up in the case of men wanting to keep a child but the women giving them up for adoption.  Which in the US doesn't happen.  Adoptions can't go through without the father's consent.  Men have the right to raise their children and can challenge adoptions and the other legal methods people can give up children.  The exact rights vary based on location, but birth father's have rights and it's a complete falsehood to state that birth mothers can give their child up for adoption no matter what the birth father says. 

When it comes to divorce and custody parental responsibility and "rights of the child" are the main concerns.  This means that if equally shared custody is not possible than the primary or sole custody is determined on the best interests of the child and who is the primary caretaker.  The is determined by which parent is more active in the day to day life of the child, who picks them up from school/when they're sick, who helps with homework, who prepared their meals.  Patriarchal gender roles mean woman are more likely to do this so mother's are more likely to get primary or sole custody.  (This isn't the case if the parents are unmarried and/or have never lived together while raising the child).  In my experience working in child care and dealing with lots of divorced/never married families (and sometimes being involved in the divorce/custody proceedings) the mothers are more likely to be awarded custody, however if the father is an active parent and wants custody of his kids then the custody will be shared equally or he'll get primary custody. 

Other generic claims - 
Benevolent Sexism really is a thing, and while it's more prevalent in places with high hostile sexism something being less worse than the alternative doesn't make it acceptable.

Actually feminists aren't man haters, hating the patriarchy isn't the name thing as hating individual men. Feminists are less likely than non-feminists to believe the male-hating ideas of "men are dogs" or "rapist is a natural state for men". 

Twitter Trolls MRAs

By: Liberate Zealot

The Hive loves a good (counter) troll of MRAs and other sexists/racists/homophobes/etc. So we adored how Twitter quickly co-opted #INeedMasculismBecause to highlight the ridiculousness of popular MRA rhetoric.  We definitely recommend checking it out, but in care you don't want to tread through the shit, we complied some of the awesome comments.

How to get her to suck *content warning*

The following is cross-posted from the Damsel in de Tech blog. Click here to see the original.

This little charmer of a headline was waiting in my Spam mailbox this morning. Rather than see what glorious (read: gross/rapey/triggering) wisdom and/or product they have to offer, I thought I'd take the opportunity to offer my own sage advice.

How to get her to suck:

1. When in her presence, or posting anywhere online where the intended female may view your comments, reinforce gender stereotypes and laud women who do the same, whilst simultaneously complimenting and slut-shaming women you find sexually attractive. Make sure that you put out as many messages as possible, post them all over your Facebook wall, tweet them, blog about them, etc. Make sure she cannot escape reading them.
   
2. Compliment her on "not being like other girls" any time she does something misogynistic. Use it as a compliment of the highest order. Encourage her to prove how much better she is than other women, especially if that means degrading other women in the process.
   
3. Sexually harass her. If she reacts badly, tell her it was a joke. Get other female friends to tell her to lighten up. Keep this up until she accepts the sexual harassment as complimentary, ordinary, and something to look forward to. Encourage her to brow-beat other women who speak out against sexual harassment.
   
4. Tell rape jokes around her. Commend her if she laughs at them. Encourage her to tell some herself. Applaud her for being so "edgy" and "not like typical girls" and "just one of the guys".
   
5. If she has a grudge or grievance with another woman or girl, encourage her to slut-shame them. The other person's sexuality doesn't even need to be remotely connected to the issue. The more acrimonious her slut-shaming, the more you should laugh and cheer her on.
   
6. Have movie nights where you watch sexually violent and degrading movies and make fun of the female characters who are brutalized in these films. If she acts uncomfortable or tries to leave the room, make fun of her, saying "it's only a movie." Make sure she knows her feelings of discomfort are both unwelcome and completely unwarranted.
   
7. Any time she is mildly unhappy or not enthusiastic, accuse her of being on her period. Use her objections as proof of her being visited by her Aunt Flo. If she admits to being on her period, say "I knew it", and make a generalized statements about how menstruation makes women inferior to men. Make sure she laughs at the joke, otherwise it's further evidence of her menstrual moodiness.
   
8. Don't let her do anything for herself. Whether it be changing a tire, changing the channel, updating her computer operating system, or anything other than shopping, cooking, and child-rearing. If she doesn't let you do things for her, accuse her of being an uppity feminist. If she does let you, use it as proof that women can't do these things.
   
9. Always use her as an example of her entire gender when she's doing something wrong/ bad/ weird, etc, and as an exception to the rule any time she does something good/ right/ cool, etc. Make sure she agrees when you point these out. If she doesn't agree, go back to #7.
   
10. Make exaggerated and sexually-charged comments about women in the media who benefit from personal trainers, plastic surgery, and air-brushing. Point out all the flaws in women you see at the grocery store, on the news, online, etc. Make sure to add a few digs here and there about her complexion, figure, hair, and how they don't match Angelina Jolie or Megan Fox. If she remarks on the personal trainers, etc, go back to #7, and/or any of the other tactics.
    
11. Ensure she's never confident in her own opinion. Even if she's 100% right. If she has evidence, say she's misunderstanding your original point, or that her evidence doesn't quite apply exactly to the particular way you've phrased the issue. Correct her at every opportunity. And when she looks to you for validation, point out that she's not confident. 

There. Now, if you go through all of the above steps with the intended woman or girl you were originally posing the question about, she will be one sucky human being. Or, she'll stop returning your calls and completely block you out of her life and devote the rest of her days to feminism and challenging schmucks like you. Really could go either way.

Now, if you are looking to know how to get someone to consent to sexual activity for you, here's a couple pieces of advice:

1. Be a decent human being.
2. Treat them like they're a decent human being.
3. If they expresses interest in you beyond friendship, try kissing them first. If they're not interested in kissing you, then stop. 
4. If they kiss you, ask if they want to go any further. If you're not comfortable verbalizing what you want, stop. If they're not comfortable verbalizing what they want, stop. 
5. Accept that sometimes, no matter how nice or decent or charming or helpful or attractive or rich or funny or brilliant or utterly amazing you are, the person you like won't want to be sexually intimate with you. Or may only want to be sexually intimate with you once. Or in a limited way. It happens. No amount of advice will get you beyond that point, because the other person has a right to not want to be with you for any reason at all, even if they can't or won't verbalize that reason.

This advice may seem counter productive insofar as it won't necessarily "get you laid". That's ok. Sex isn't something you're owed. It's not something your partner is owed. It doesn't have to be in the context of a long-term, monogamous, heterosexual relationship, but it does have to be with enthusiastic consent by everyone involved at all times. 

Consent and respect and very sexy. If the person you're interested in doesn't seem to think so, time to move on, because your boundaries and safety are important, too.

Who's the victim? Co-opting activist language is en vogue.

The following is cross-posted from the Damsel in de Tech blog. Click here to see the original.

Who's the boss? Who's the victim? Evidence of a feministicalogical conspiracy
to enslave teh menz? You be the judge...

I'm not the sort of blogger who is able to keep on top of every new topic that comes along. Not least of all because there's so much shit that happens all the time. If this were a full-time job, I'm still not sure I could do it. I'd likely miss deadlines as I cowered under my covers, hugging my teddy bear and softly singing to myself, "It can't rain all the time".

Actually, it probably can.

So, given that I'm not trying to keep up with the minutiea, sitting back and watching from a slight distance provides some clearer perspective on overall trends that I've been noticing (I'm certainly not the only one, as you'll see, because I'm quoting posts from Manboobz.com).

For example, it's interesting (read: ridiculous & depressing) that the term "victim" is being simultaneously misappropriated and maligned by groups and individuals who wouldn't know what it is to be a victim if it came up and slapped them upside the head (which would be ironic, because then they'd be victims of assault). I know that this isn't just something that MRAs do, I just know that I'm more aware of their hijacking of the term because I find it deeply offensive and obnoxious.

They seem to have recognized that people tend to sympathize with "victims". So, in wrenching sympathy from those who deserve and need it (i.e. - people who have been actually victimized), they've adopted a tactic of "Don't sympathize with them! They're chowder heads! Look at us! We've got hangnails because women are teh debbil! We don't like it when people criticize us for being so shitty, so we're going to co-opt their language unironically to excuse and pretty-up our abuse."

One of the more frustrating things about this tactic, is that genuinely nice people who actively work to support survivors of various forms of violence and oppression don't always know how to react to it. When someone states they are being oppressed or victimized, the standard response from good people is to try to support them and work with them to alievate what it is that is affecting them. When it's cis people claiming that the existence and acknowledgment of trans people are oppressing them by "reinforcing negative gender stereotypes by trying to conform to the opposite-sex" (I shit you not, I've seen that argument), good people are often gobsmacked into silence. Like, what do you say to such a bizarre misappropriation of the language of anti-oppression work?

Here are my suggestions for how to deal with people who usurp activist language to justify their bullshit:

1. GIF party - when people are being absurd, sometimes the only logical and sane response is a lolcat

2. MEME party - similar to GIF party, but can also be done without pictures. Eg. - "What is this? I don't even"
3. Short answers, "That is the stupidest thing I've ever heard." - unfortunately, while this is often the first response that comes to mind, it often leads the OP to demand that you "prove" what they said is false, inaccurate, misleading, batshit insane, etc. Sometimes that can be difficult in the moment, because their claims are just so bizarre that no rational breakdown rebuttal immediately comes to mind.
4. Post links stats and studies to the contrary - this can be helpful when you are so gobsmacked you can't formulate a response other than to point to someone else who has already laid out an eloquent response
5. Ask questions. This can be very helpful in getting over the initial "O_________O" response. Keep asking questions, like: "How exactly does recognizing and honouring the experiences of transgendered persons negatively affect you as a cis woman?", and "And you came to this conclusion how?" and "And how has denying and ignoring the existence of oppression helped women so far?" and even "Are you posting ironically? Because it's pretty bang-on if you're being facetious in order to highlight the absurdity of the claims of those who find it expedient to discount their own levels of privilege."
6. Take a break. I know that with discussions online, sometimes 5 minutes can feel like an eternity, and any time away from the topic can feel like the other side is "winning" by filling up the conversation with venom that echoes when not addressed. But, seriously, if you're gobsmacked or your face is turning red because you are so irate that someone could post something so offensive, it's ok to take a break. Often, with a bit of distance (even as short as 5-10 min) comes greater clarity in how to respond. And, in your absense, it's possible someone else will also chime in and put into words what you have been trying to express. Allies are awesome that way.
7. Stop responding. This may be counter-intuitive, but sometimes it can be very effective to let a ridiculous comment stand on its own without comment. Posts can echo, and sometimes the silence that follows can be more powerful than any other response.
8. Copy and paste. If you've been posting online about social justice issues for any length of time, chances are you've repeated yourself, and perhaps have repeated yourself so many times you can't be arsed to type the entire response out again. That's why I started updating a document with my most-common arguments. No sense reinventing the wheel. If people are going to keep lazily rehashing insults and out-dated arguments from a half-century ago, then you're allowed to repost something you said last week.
9. Build a group of allies. I've got a great collection of amazing people that I rely on as a sounding board and comic relief when dealing with these issues. Sometimes I'm too close to the issue or too upset to respond in a timely manner, so I go to them to see if they're able to respond, instead. It's not 100% assured someone is around to respond, but having people there to vent to helps regardless.

Now, I'm sure there are many other ways to address these types of arguments, and your mileage may vary on any and all of these suggestions. Whatever happens, know that you're not insane and, yes, they are really maliciously co-opting activist language, and yes, it really is fucking offensive. But at least you're not alone.